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English Captain of the Guard
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Roland
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PostPosted: Wed Sep 27, 2006 9:47 pm    Post subject: English Captain of the Guard Reply with quote

Last night I faced my toughest fencing opponent ever - the Captain of the Guard in an English port.

In the past I have lost a number of duels while dabbling at Swashbuckler, which is still beyond my ability, and a couple of times Montalban has given me trouble. But in all of those instance I was fighting aboard a ship with an outnumbered crew and none of the fencing items.

In this instance, playing at Rogue, I was fighting one-on-one in a tavern and I had all the fencing items. (I had just acquired the final item, the Cuirass, when a mysterious stranger offered it to me for the unheard-of low price of 3,750. I usually stick with the Leather Vest just because I think it looks cooler. I had long since acquired the other items from governor's daughters.)

He was using a rapier, as English Captains are wont to do. I was using a cutlass, my preferred weapon against the most challenging opponents. (I have learned not to take Captains of the Guard for granted - they are often worthy opponents on par with jealous fiances!) I quickly found that none of my usual tactics worked against him. Even with the advantage bar 90% in my favor and white lines swirling around his head, when I would duck under his chop and follow up with a thrust he would block it! And his thrusts often beat my parries - the Cuirass was the only thing that saved me from an early defeat.

I had no choice but to resort to taunting. I don't usually taunt a lot, so my fingers don't have the patterns down. I made a couple of mistakes, and he capitalized on them. I never recovered. He chased me back up the stairs and eventually pushed me out the window.

After dusting myself off and ascertaining that I was not seriously injured, I immediately returned to the tavern for another go. Using very conservative tactics in combination with a lot of taunts, I slowly pushed him within range of the barmaid, who finished the fight in her usual way.

I wish I had thought to save the scenario. It would be a good one to return to for practice.
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Wolfwood
Boatswain
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 5:13 am    Post subject: Re: English Captain of the Guard Reply with quote

Yup, some of those fights really are good practice! Wink

One thing I just have to comment on (the boring historian is here again! run while you still can!):

Roland wrote:
He was using a rapier, as English Captains are wont to do.


This is pretty curious, since historically the English never really got excited about the continental swords that they called rapiers. Instead, the English used the tuck (thrust only sword) or heavier blades (almost broadswords) that were preferred by George Silver (their main mentor of swordsmanship).

It was only later that the English decided that the tuck and the rapier are basically the same thing ( Rolling Eyes ) that they theoretically started using rapiers (but they were really only thrust only weapons, i.e. tucks). The English basically bastardized the terminology and lost the difference between the two sword types - a confusion that still bothers us in the present day.

Oh, the English Tuck was called an Estoc in Italy (hence, the quote in my sig)
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It is much better to be armed with a sword that has two edges than with an estoc [...], which is nothing more than a stick with a point. (Rapier Master G. Morsicato Pallavicini, La Scherma Illustrata, p. 14.)
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TheDon
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 1:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The English COG is by far the most challenging swordsman... even moreso than Montalban, in my experience.
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Roland
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PostPosted: Thu Sep 28, 2006 8:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Last night I fought Montalban on land for the first time at Rogue. He was actually beating me until I found his weakness: After jumping over his slash I could often beat him with the counter-thrust (but I could not beat him after ducking under his chop, interestingly).

My duel with the English Captain was good preparation for Montalban, since it forced me to experiment with taunting and withholding my counterattacks until conditions were optimal.
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Darth Rustito
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PostPosted: Sat Sep 30, 2006 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I actually faced the English captain of the guard recently as well, and was quite surprised at his efficiency with a blade. He's a far cry from most of the naval captains I tend to run into on the open seas, although he wasn't quite as hard as one fellow I had the distinct displeasure of mixing it up with one time. I boarded a pirate sloop once, and I tell you, that captain nearly sent me overboard. Even the English COG wasn't as hard as him. He wasn't one of the named pirates, either. Just some randomized one.

Odd how the difficulty spikes up so sharply on some of those guys.
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Roland
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PostPosted: Sun Oct 01, 2006 1:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It seems to me that the fencing skills of all combatants other than named villains, criminals, and pirates are determined randomly. While military captains are nearly always better than merchant captains, for instance, within each category you can find a range of skill levels. That goes for captains of the guard too - not every English CoG is as good as that one I faced recently. And occasionally you'll run into a really tough pirate captain as well.
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Gmatt
Swabbie
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PostPosted: Thu Oct 05, 2006 9:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I love taking him on with all the goodies, on Rouge when very old. Smile

You cannot hit him at all even when advantage is totaly yours, and you are counter attacking. The only way is faking it/not faking it.

I find that after faking the same thing a few times they hang on, so I fake slahs, thrust, and then once in a while when I see him parrying for the thrust I let the slash go right across his legs! It sure is tough.. He is one of the few guys to beat me in while..

I think that with a cutlass, if you miss an attack, you will bw off ballance longer than witha rapier, is this correct? It would make sense (as it is harder to stop something heavier).
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Tom Pullings
Gunner
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PostPosted: Sat Oct 07, 2006 9:10 pm    Post subject: Avoiding that face in the window (most of the time) Reply with quote

The English Captain is tough. To make it work on swash I ended up relying on a feint and parry strategy. I found that if I tried to jump or duck I was often just too slow, and once I got off pace, I just got marched out the window before I could recover. If I used the parry to block, I was then able to launch a feint and reverse and usually score (either a low slash feint followed by a high chop, or the opposite - fake high and go low), after which I would again parry, before another feint and reverse. After a while I started using alternating patterns, parry; low/high; parry; high low - or two low/highs, then switch to high/low - but usually with a parry in between each feint/strike sequence. This let me restablish pace and absorb a few hits without getting steam rolled. Eventually, I got to where I could vary this and stay on the attack for a couple rounds if I scored and the opponent was not too fast. I still lost some where I guessed wrong and walked into an attack, but now I can usually interrupt that demoralizing sequence of getting pushed back while you just seem to get slower and slower, and turn the fight around. Very Happy
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Lill-Troll
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 14, 2007 2:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I had an encounter like that teh other day. Only it was a Fiance.He's initial swing was faster than my thrust, and I just couldn't seem to recover from it. Eventually, just one more hit from beeing disarmed, I managed to get back on top of him and drive him back to the middle.

After that, it was swinging back and forth for a loooooong time. Eventually I managed to drop the bowl on his head
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Tom Pullings
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 3:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Don't know if others see this, but it seems that every so often the game just throws you an opponent that is way tougher than expected. I see this on land and at sea, though at sea it may be harder to isolate because of other factors like crew happiness. Often at least one of the named pirates seems tougher or even an unkown pirate - same for the sea battle phase before boarding. I think in addition to the expected factors there is a random wild card built in.
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Captain Shark
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PostPosted: Sun Mar 04, 2007 6:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There was one time I challenged a English COG with a cutlass and lost. But I easily beat him with a longsword. I could defend fast enough with it, and I could attack faster than the cutlass. The balance of the longsword helps where the other two fail in situations like this.
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Capt. Cannon
Cutthroat
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PostPosted: Fri May 18, 2007 12:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thibnk your only shot against this type is to use the bes rapier you can find, and beat him to the attack.
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beckett
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PostPosted: Mon Mar 10, 2008 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

does it depend WHICH port you be fightin' the english COG?

beat COG in port royale but got beat by COG in english-held san juan in current game (apprentice mode...failing health)

btw...can u go back and re-fight COG u lost to or that's it...to regain favour w/ beautiful daughter or offer of younger sis final?
(means one has to court another beau offspring from another port and thru whole bloody process...a-gain)

Shocked
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Roland
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PostPosted: Tue Mar 11, 2008 5:06 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

beckett wrote:
does it depend WHICH port you be fightin' the english COG?

beat COG in port royale but got beat by COG in english-held san juan in current game (apprentice mode...failing health)

Not every COG is equally competent as a swordsman. As with captains of vessels at sea, you'll find a range of proficiency levels.

beckett wrote:
btw...can u go back and re-fight COG u lost to or that's it...to regain favour w/ beautiful daughter or offer of younger sis final?
(means one has to court another beau offspring from another port and thru whole bloody process...a-gain)

Ummm . . . are you confusing the COG with the jealous fiance? You fight the COG in the tavern when he is bothering the barmaid. You fight the fiance by the governor's fountain.

You only get to fight the jeaous fiance once. If you lose to him and you hear about the younger sister, then you have to start over in that city.
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